Human behavior is a factor here on the user side. I’d wager that the number of people who could afford to donate $5 to a Rack plugin developer (and who like a plugin enough to want to do that) is an order of magnitude higher than the number of people who actually donate.
As much as building source code is only a small inconvenience for some Rack users, the current donation process is similarly inconvenient. (Often you wind-up paying toll to an awful company like PayPal, too.)
I think it’s also important not to understate the value of Rack’s built-in update system. Subscribing to that notification stream and being able to update with a couple clicks is a major benefit for most users. The inconvenience of building from source is potentially incurred many times, if a plugin has a particularly active developer.
In addition to allowing sale of open source plugins, VCV could allow developers to make their free plugins Pay-What-You-Want, as seen on Bandcamp. I think this would also see more use than the current donation options.
It would be interesting to see how that worked out in practice - I suspect as most don’t donate, most would want to pay 0 - It might lead to a bit of an increase though… who knows.
This is simply because people like getting things for free. Getting something for nothing feels good. They may not mind paying for them at all if that’s the only (convenient) option there is, but they’ll take free if its there.
I’d love to know the percentage of people who pay ‘0’ at Bandcamp.
I’ve put 0 in at bandcamp many times but I’ve also started paying for what I get. As a Rack user I can definitely attest to being extremely grateful for all the work that is available for free and I would gladly pay something for all of them.
However, a donate link in the context of the module is not effective. When I am in Rack and doing anything with a module the last thing I want to do it is to come out of Rack and figure out how to make a payment, I opened rack to be creative and make sounds. If there was an option for it when subscribing I definitely would, it’s a much more suitable place for it to be.
I mean surely if even 10% of people paid something then VCV makes more money and developers get more money. It might also incentivize devs to create higher quality modules or to push the boundaries further.
I actually considered it, then learned it isn’t allowed. It’s really not easy to set up a vcv build system, esp for someone who has never used a command line. I kind of doubt that the open source would significantly cannibalize sales.
Why would I do that? because I’m lazy. I like VCV building all my binaries.
I’ll be perfectly honest: I have 4 modules that have been nearly-complete for about a year now. During that year, I have had no desire to finish or publish them, and I’m not sure when I will in the future. Aside from a number of wonderful and supportive people, who I am very grateful for, I broadly don’t feel welcome in the VCV community. I prefer to live a very private online life, so I won’t get into specific details here, but I do not get the sense that this community is for people like me.
That being said, I’ll continue to support Substation indefinitely, and I do periodically check the forum for DMs, etc. And who knows–I may change my mind and release those plugins in the future. I may also just port them to standalone VSTs/AUs.
Edit: it’s probably worth mentioning that my day job is very draining and has left me significantly burned out. It’s probably likely that I’ll change my mind about VCV once I’m able to find a less stressful job.
This makes me sad to hear. I really enjoy your modules and was fine with the open-sourcing plan. I hope after awhile we can share space here in the community with you again!
Your Substation project was the most impressive “all round” project I have ever seen in Rack. By “all round” I don’t just mean the modules themselves, which were excellent, but the approach, the philosophy, the design, the marketing, the website, the manual, the way you priced them, the promise to release the source code after a year which you did… all of it was just absolutely top notch.
I don’t really understand why you wouldn’t feel welcome here as I’m sure most Rack users feel similarly about what you managed to achieve. (I’m not prying or wanting you to explain). I can only imagine it has something to do with the negative direct communications you received from a vocal minority after releasing the source code. I’m truly sorry you had to deal with that as there was nothing wrong with what you did imo - quite the contrary. You were open and honest about everything from the start and did exactly what you said you would. Nothing but respect here.
I think you have a great product with Substation, I really love using it. I do think porting it to AU/VST/VST3 is a very smart move. This is your product, your baby. Do whatever you want, enjoy freedom. Regarding a career, think about what you have (substation), and when designing a port, think about how it can help you build something that may get you out of your current situation. I think it has the potential, and if you already have 4 additional modules, save them for a plugin port. Dont release them on VCV. I wouldnt. I would save them and launch my own plugin.
I personally prefer to have a clear distinction on what’s open source, what’s free and what’s paid.
I do think that changing the “rules of the game” does not feel good for the users. Like suddenly open-sourcing (or making free) a paid plugin. Specially if the paid cost was significant (the exact amount varies from person to person).
We have had a few cases of open source where the “rules” have been made clear from the beginning. I remember a developer (you could help me with the name) that said that he/she was going to make a module, and open the code once a certain amount of donations was reached.
The second case I remember was the Audible Instruments Preview. Where you paid to have early access to the module, knowing that the code was going to be open after some months.
Not specifically when purchasing VCV stuff, but it has happened to me a few times that I purchase gear or software and some days/weeks after the manufacturer drops a big discount. That makes me upset my myself for not waiting a little bit.
If you have been here long enough, you may remember that I used to have a “donations” button for the Vult modules. Back then I received very disproportionate donations ranging from $0.001 to $100. The tiny donations are completely useless since PayPal takes all the money. The large donations made me feel uncomfortable. That why I decided to go with the paid modules route. That way there is a fixed donation amount. If you cannot afford it, you can still enjoy all the free modules. If you can donate, you get back a set of my most complex modules.
The sad part of the paid plugins is that they have a 0.1% of the users of free modules.
In summary, I think that the rules set by VCV are reasonable. They do not let you do whatever you want but they are easy for the end user.
That’s can’t be right, surely? So if there were 10,000 Vult users only 10 of them bought the premium plugins?
I feel like this is a misleading statistic though. It would include all the people who installed Rack to give it a try, subscribed to Vult Free but then gave up. It would be interesting to see what the ratio is like for people who have been using Rack for more than a couple of months.
I do not have neither exact or updated numbers. I was thinking on the number of VCV Rack users compared to the people that has purchased a Vult paid module. VCV Rack has a massive number of users. If the real number is 1% then 99 out of 100 persons do not have the “pleasure” of using my paid modules.
The point here is not how little or how much a paid plugin sells. It’s more about how paid plugins have less traction. The number of times I see one of my paid modules displayed on a video is small compared to the free modules. Many users actively avoid paid modules because the patches cannot be shared with all the users. Thankfully for me, there are in the community power users that create really cool things using some of my paid modules.
Regarding my paid modules, I thought about making Vult Opulus part of one of my paid packages because I spent many hours developing it (making the prototype boards, analyzing it, improving it, etc). But if it would be a paid product, I would be restricting the use of Opulus and I really want people to try it. But thanks to the good reception of the VCV Drums I got a very decent payment and decided to make both Opulus and Jorus free.
Big thanks to all of you who have purchased my plugins. When I started receiving money, I thought about buying some expensive synth once I had enough contributions. But what really ended up happening is that I’m using that money to build the hardware and prototypes I’m interested to create. That is more rewarding to me than going to a store and picking the most expensive gear. With that money I finance my research and that results in more modules.
I do notice this tendency to pick a free module over a commercial one for the reason you mentioned. Even if I don’t plan on sharing it in the future. Another personal reason might be that limiting myself to using only free modules force me the be more creative. This is also true for the Host and Host FX module. I really like my Valhalla delay and reverb, but in 95% percent of my noodlings I’ll use Plateau and Chronoblob.
I don’t want to hijack this awesome thread, but a question that I have been asking myself ever since I started VCV some months ago is:
Why are there so few established commercial and open source VST developers coming to VCV?
I know we have Cytomic, Surge, Chow DSP, etc. But given the openness of VCV and pull of affordable modular in the audio world on one side and the vast number of VST’s out there on the other, it is a surprisingly low number in my estimation.
I’m probably biased and irrationally prefer an integrated VCV module on my screen with lights and cables over Host FX and a modal window. But still, why so few?
- It might lead to a bit of an increase though… who knows.